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Forum topic: Why alienate your customers?

Why alienate your customers?

Darren Edgar

03 Jan 2020 12:08 #5074

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Thankfully it looks like the organisation barely represents any businesses anyway:

www.lovepalmersgreen.com/member.html

Used to really like Dipali but I've been going to Nurjenna in Southgate recently anyway which is much nicer. Can't think I've used any of the other businesses for several years at least.

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Why alienate your customers?

Dru Loizou

04 Jan 2020 10:36 #5075

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Thanks for sharing, Ann.

Aside from accusing new Fox Lane area residents of snobbery, claiming that the proposal was designed by ‘a handful of residents’ (don’t believe this to be true) and using the opportunity to have another moan about the cycle lanes, I don’t see any points outlining why they think the proposal will negatively impact their businesses.

With so many campaigns encouraging people to shop locally, antagonising their closest potential punters will only hurt their businesses further as people will choose to vote with their feet.

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Why alienate your customers?

PGC Webmaster

08 Jan 2020 14:42 #5087

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Hopefully not at the cost of damage to my eyesight, I've managed to decipher the Green Lanes Business Association document that was posted to this forum last week. I assume that it was a letter to the council. WARNING: Some residents may find it upsetting.

Fox Lane Quieter Neighbourhood Proposal Feedback

1. Extremely short notice of initial meeting 12th November 2019. Due to purdah, local councillors did not attend the presentation on 12/11/19 and therefore attendees (both residents and shopkeepers) still have no idea what the councillors' views are.

2. Deadline of consultation has been extended, and yet there have been no further meetings, presentations or exhibits of proposals arranged for people to attend and ask further questions. This can't be a correct and fair way to conduct an apparent consultation.

3. It's questionable as to how committed the London Borough of Enfield (LBE) is to this proposal - thus far only one key individual at the council has been named and linked as the driving force behind this proposal. All other information and leaflets are missing one key thing - LBE's logo. One of the leaflets distributed clearly states that it was designed and produced by the Fox Lane Area Residents - how is it acceptable for a handful of residents to be able to push forward so publically on something that is so much bigger than just the "Fox Lane Area Residents"? The ONLY thing that clearly shows a link of any sort to LBE is the feedback link - letstalk.enfield.gov.uk/foxlaneQN - the public's understanding is that this notion is being consulted on without the support of LBE's cabinet members - thereby allowing for the reasonable assumption that this is quite literally the pet project of one individual employed by the council who has allowed themselves to be manipulated by a minority number of people into this idea. This council employee and minor group of residents are wearing blinders over their eyes - they cannot see and have not considered the extreme ricochet effect that something like this could have on the area.

4. This is not about climate change and pollution - this is about snobbery that never existed in Palmers Green until a few years ago when there was an influx of new residents to the area who CHOSE to live in PG. The appeal of PG to such new residents would have been not only the choice in properties, but schools and the local town centre, which was thriving until the cycle lanes were implemented. The Fox Lane Area Residents (FLAR) are using climate change and pollution as a facade to get what they want - a village lifestyle in the outskirts of the UK's capital city of London.

5. Pollution - while we are not oblivious to pollution and its effects etc - it appears to have been completely ignored that pollution travels, it does not just hover exclusively over the Lakes Estate. Omitting cars and through traffic from one section does not solve the issue of pollution overall - in fact what is being proposed is only going to increase pollution in all the surrounding roads and beyond - gridlocked traffic will most definitely be the increased pollution trigger due to people having to make longer journeys and cars sitting with engines running. What is being proposed is yet again enforcing the snobbery - that the Lakes Estate should have nice clean quiet car free roads - while in the meantime traffic, noise and pollution increases in all the surrounding areas for pedestrians, residents, school children, businesses and commuters. Why should the many have to put up with this to appease the few? We are aware that this proposed scheme is also being discussed to be rolled out across the whole area of Palmers Green which is ludicrous.

6. Rat running - this is very offensive terminology. Drivers who are taking their children to school, going to work, appointments, shopping are NOT rat runners. They have every right to use the roads they pay road tax for. Please refrain from using this terminology.

7. Business - since the completion of the cycle lanes where LBE's research showed apparent increase in trade and the local economy (DESPITE the common sense feedback opposing this, particularly in relation to reduced parking and access for deliveries) the result has been the polar opposite - in 2016 there were only 3 empty shops in PG, now at the end of 2019 there are 18 with more units vacating in the new year. It has been a berating task for shopkeepers to remain enthusiastic and maintain appeal to consumers when parking has changed and remaining spaces are almost non-existent.

This FLQN will have a detrimental effect on high street businesses in PG - what customer in their right mind would want to travel an extra 2 miles in some instances to to to their local high street to use services and shop locally?

LBE needs to come forward and confirm if they are pro or anti this scheme. LBE needs to understand that people are not stupid — both shopkeepers and landlords are wise to the fact that LBE has no incentive to assist or support local business because LBE's income on business rates is never affected - if a unit is vacant LBE still gets the business rates paid in full each and every month. LBE bears no responsibility to business and its high time this attitude changes OR LBE can come clean and be honest about what the 10, 20 and 50 year plans are for this area of PG and for once show transparency.

8. Community - everyone likes to throw this word around — it used to mean something: residents, businesses, council, education, policing, health services and more — as a group these worked together and that WAS community. The word 'community' is now used more as the 'Royal we' — it doesn't mean or reflect any of the above anymore. It's a word that is thrown about to try and sugar coat things that the majority of people won't like.

9. Trial period — if you are going to move forward with the trial period, you should be doing it from September to March, and not March to September when more people are away and more people walk and cycle during the spring and summer months. Your current time period allocated to this trial would not be a true reflection of the volume of road usage and would only make your data more favourable for your proposal. This is unjust.

A thriving Town Centre is the heart of every real community — our Town Centre is a ghost town and closing off major access points will be the final nail in the coffin of what was once a busy and vibrant Town Centre.

If this is to be genuinely considered as a viable option for people beyond this consultation the GLBA would suggest a proper referendum inclusive of ALL boundary areas. We would also request impact reports reflecting environmental, traffic and equalities to be carried out and provided by reputable independent companies.

The GLBA would suggest alternative tried and tested measures for traffic calming and flow — a ladder system which has been successful in both Haringey and the other side of the North Circular Road (These areas are far more relatable to PG than Walthamstow), 20mph speed limits, speed cameras. More policing is required — need to be seen walking day and night all year round not just when there is political gain to be had. Policing is required to support businesses and residents. For those wishing to enjoy quieter, greener and cleaner living they an make more use of the local parks with their children and have picnics if they with and nice bike rides.

The GLBA does not support this proposal under any circumstances. We represent the voice of the local businesses and they want and need to be heard. A [full?] consultation must be carried out by genuine experts — not bored individuals who have nothing better to do with their time than to try and create a non-existent bubble to live in. The UK has ample villages and areas to live in that are green, have no traffic and many bicycles. London and Greater London areas are not these kinds of places.

The GLBA will ALWAYS put business first and will NEVER stop fighting for local trade, businesses, shopkeepers and the local economy.

Regards
Costas Georgiou
Chairman of the Green Lanes Business Association
For and on behalf of the Green Lanes Business Association Committee and Members

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Why alienate your customers?

Adrian Day

08 Jan 2020 17:18 #5088

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So the organisation that purports to be fighting for local businesses insults around 3000 customers and potential customers living right next door. You couldn’t make it up.

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Why alienate your customers?

Karl Brown

09 Jan 2020 07:52 #5092

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Surely a spoof, for which credible retailer would totally diss their core customer base; which community leader under a Love PG banner go on to demolish that very same community; which long term car advocate would highlight them as dirty, noisy and polluting; which manager and planner would wake up to read of the UK’s worst retailing year since records began and blame the problem on PG’s cycle lanes; and who would stand and attack Lakes Estate residents and a proposed Low Traffic Neighbourhood when they are themselves are a long term resident of the Lakes Estate Conservation Area and live in its only LTN?
No, surely a spoof, and if not then probably time for traders to consider ditching toxicity-risking membership, maybe contemplating aligning with the PG Action Team who seem to have made positive strides on several fronts in getting to grips with some of the actual changes local retail requires.

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Why alienate your customers?

Darren Edgar

09 Jan 2020 10:44 #5094

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why do my posts keep getting deleted?

is it because i previously made an unwelcomed comment about political propagandising...?

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Why alienate your customers?

PGC Webmaster

09 Jan 2020 11:25 #5095

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David Eden wrote:

why do my posts keep getting deleted?

is it because i previously made an unwelcomed comment about political propagandising...?


Because you keep playing the man, not the ball. And not necessarily the right man. Let's stick to the arguments, not just slag people off.

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Why alienate your customers?

roger dougall

09 Jan 2020 14:01 #5096

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This is not a spoof.You can believe it is a spoof if it suits your narrative.It sums up what virtually all the residents in the area think. Look at all the red posters out there!
The following user(s) said Thank You: David Berkovitch

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