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artists impression of refurbished fox pub in palmers greenAn artist's impression of what the Fox will look like after reopening

Notices were displayed in the windows of the Fox on Wednesday morning, announcing that the pub would be reopening in January and advertising for staff. Rather oddly, the notices referred to "The Fox Wood Green", but the windows they were in were definitely in the Fox Palmers Green. However, by 4pm the notices had disappeared - hence the question mark in the headline. (Perhaps they were relocated to the Fox Wood Green?)

the fox wood green announcement

An edited version of the notices displayed in the windows of the Fox on Wednesday morning, that had disappeared by 4pm.

But let's assume that the notices were in the windows of the right pub and didn't disappear because the plans to reopen the Fox have fallen through, but for some other reason.

It seems that the Fox will become part of Akw Pubs, a small chain run by Austin Whelan, whose signature adorned the notices. However, from research on the internet it appears that the chain trades under the name Whelan's and its pubs are leased from Star Pubs & Bars, a subsidiary of the international brewing giant Heineken (the "Star" in the company's name was the logo of Newcastle Breweries, one of hundreds - thousands? - of companies swallowed up by the black holes at the centre of the international brewing industry).

Whelan's, based in Sawbridgeworth, currently have three "Irish Traditional" and five "Whelan's Premium" pubs, most located in London suburbs. The About page on their website states that:

Whelan’s Pub Company was set up in 2007 and we now operate eight pubs across London and the south. Each is either a Whelan’s Irish Traditional or a Whelan’s Premium pub.

All have the same aim: to deliver a warm and vibrant Irish welcome to all our guests.

Music and the top sport action are at the heart of our offering; big screens and the very best of live – mainly Irish! -  music features throughout the week at each of our venues.

Our brand thrives in town centre locations, and we love our huge mix of guests – from students to families, fans of football, racing and rugby to those looking for a quiet pint!

Whelan’s. Perfect pubs, whatever the occasion.

So it looks as though the reopened, smaller Fox, boasting its splendid weatherfox, will have more in common with the Fox as it was before it closed than we might have expected: a renewed Irish welcome, and big screens showing sports.

Log in to comment
Michael Mor posted a reply
01 Dec 2022 04:37
The carvery in the original Fox was something to behold!
I believe Whelan's other pubs do food, carvery I'm not sure.
I wish them well!
Sarah Dowling posted a reply
01 Dec 2022 07:36
So disappointed to read this. We already have an Irish pub offering sport.
I was hoping for a pub with proper beer, high quality food, community events. Something like the Winchmore or Prince. Seems like they haven't researched the local needs if they are saying wood green either. Guess we might still have to go to Winchmore hill for a proper pub.
Adrian Day posted a reply
01 Dec 2022 09:16
I'm pleased a company is taking the lease on and look forward to visiting. Hope food is part of the offer
Basil Clarke posted a reply
01 Dec 2022 17:50


As I suspected, the notices were taken down yesterday afternoon because they erroneously stated that the Fox was in Wood Green. The new notices that appeared today have taken a more cautious approach by just saying "413 Green Lanes N13 4JD" - perhaps they were cautious about saying Palmers Green in case it actually turned out that the Fox is in Winchmore Hill!
Basil Clarke posted a reply
01 Dec 2022 18:00
Sarah Dowling wrote (message 6687) :

So disappointed to read this. We already have an Irish pub offering sport.
I was hoping for a pub with proper beer, high quality food, community events. Something like the Winchmore or Prince.


I imagine the Fox will be one of the Whelan's Premium pubs - if you look on their website you can see all the existing Premium pubs, and they look fine, not like the fake Irish pubs.

I'd rather not have the TV screens, but perhaps pub economics these days makes them essential.
Darren Edgar posted a reply
02 Dec 2022 10:18
Sarah Dowling wrote (message 6687) :

So disappointed to read this. We already have an Irish pub offering sport.
I was hoping for a pub with proper beer, high quality food, community events. Something like the Winchmore or Prince. Seems like they haven't researched the local needs if they are saying wood green either. Guess we might still have to go to Winchmore hill for a proper pub.


Which is the Irish pub in PG?I love the Winchmore and the Kings Head in WMH and agree PG has been crying out for something nice (current scene is a complete dog, epitomised by the awful Spoonies) but from what I've seen of this guys other venues they do seem nice and smart with good food/drink options. Did you not think the same?
Sarah Dowling posted a reply
08 Dec 2022 07:18
Existing Irish pub is the Wishing Well.
I looked at the Google reviews for the existing Whelan's premium pubs and didn't think they were very positive. Didn't feel like a premium offering.
I agree it's great it will open at all, but reviews don't lead me to expect quality food, beer or decor.
PGC Webmaster posted a reply
14 Dec 2022 23:44


Work to fit out the Fox is now under way and this new sign has appeared on the exterior of the building. I like the mention of local produce.
Darren Edgar posted a reply
20 Dec 2022 10:18
Sarah Dowling wrote (message 6695) :

Existing Irish pub is the Wishing Well.


Ah yes, Wishing Well, quite a dingy little place that I never go in there anymore. That's a pretty low bar to set standards-wise so the new Fox can only be an improvement! Can only dream of Winchmore Hill quality pubs....
Basil Clarke posted a reply
21 Dec 2022 23:05
Darren Edgar wrote (message 6709) :

Ah yes, Wishing Well, quite a dingy little place that I never go in there anymore. That's a pretty low bar to set standards-wise so the new Fox can only be an improvement! Can only dream of Winchmore Hill quality pubs....


I've only been in the Wishing Well a few times, but that's because it doesn't sell real ale, not because it's "dingy". It's always struck me as well run, having a friendly atmosphere and being a proper local, somewhere where regulars can drop in and have a chat with someone they know and perhaps make some new acquaintances. That makes it an invaluable community asset.

As for dreaming about Winchmore Hill pubs, in some cases when it comes to their prices it's more of a nightmare.
Darren Edgar posted a reply
22 Dec 2022 09:17
Narrow frontage with minimal glazing. Deep with little natural light. Dated decor. To me that is a dingy pub even if it might function as a friendly local boozer. Beer selection wasn't good from memory let alone if you don't drink beer....
Michael Mor posted a reply
05 Jan 2023 08:01
For God's sake, give it a chance!
It hasn't even opened its doors yet and you get a comment like this.
Nobody will stick a shotgun up your posterior and force you to enter!
Sue Beard posted a reply
05 Jan 2023 10:44
This is why I don’t log in that often. There is always someone who wants to do stuff down.

People have different ideas of what a pub is, but that is fine. Different pubs suit different people.

The building has been refurbished- a win. It’s still a pub- a win. The company are investing in it - a win , especially in these times. The fox had got very run down and the beers it’s had a few years ago is irrelevant. This is a new offer.

As for the wishing well, it’s a traditional more homely boozer. It’s not meant to be sparkly or ersatz or trendy like the majority of Winchmore Hill pubs. It is very well run, and the girls work their socks off, and always have a friendly welcome. Let’s not put people off going in with thoughtless comments and let’s give the fox and every new business a chance.
Karl Brown posted a reply
05 Jan 2023 14:22
Adding to the Wishing Well’s support from Sue, it is indeed a top spot. Walking in on Tuesday the always lovely staff knew my desired beer without any need of a prompt and brought it to my chosen spot, a seat from where it was possible to switch to a view of the world darts championship from Aly Paly on the other telly whenever out-matched Arsenal were trying to bore a class Newcastle team into submission. How Mikel Arteta avoided a red card for his touchline displays of pique, disgraceful with children and impressionable adults invariable watching, is surely a matter for the FA. Landlady Christine would have made a much more effective ref.
A sea of fancy dress at one venue and shirtless Geordies in the other audience highlighted the country making the most of its Brexit opportunities. Not a dinginess to be seen.
Sarah Dowling posted a reply
06 Jan 2023 17:23
Looks like it's nearly ready to open! Exciting.



Darren Edgar posted a reply
10 Jan 2023 12:19
www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/dingier

Lacking light or brightness. Literally the dictionary definition.

Doesn't mean it's a bad boozer.